When should I start potty-training my child? How do I know they are ready? Is bedwetting normal? Our co-worker Cassie is here to calm all of our fears and answer our questions. From signs of potty-training readiness, developmental stages, positive ways to encourage our children, and more! After listening to this episode we hope you will leave feeling encouraged and with a potty-training plan.
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Hilary: Welcome to the Parents Place podcast with Hilary and Jen. Hello, everyone. Excited to have you guys here again. I am flying solo when it comes to the hostess responsibilities. Jen isn't able to be here with us today, but I am definitely not alone because I have my colleague here with me, Cassie, and she is a wealth of knowledge. I'm so excited that she is here today because she has a topic I guarantee you're going to want to hear about. So, I'm really excited, but I'll let her introduce herself and tell a little bit about what she does here at our office.
Cassie: All right. Thank you, Hilary. So like Hilary said, my name is Cassie Alarcon. If you listen to the podcast before, you may have heard me and I'm excited to be back. I do work here at the Family Place. I have a few different positions and one of the things that I do is work on the Parents as Teachers’ program. So, I'm a home visitor. I go in and help parents who have children ages five and under, and we talk about their child's development ways to support their child. And we talk about big milestones and things that are going on, such as potty training, which is what we will be discussing today.
Hilary: And it was so, it's funny because I've talked about my kids on this. I have four kids that I have potty trained, and if someone were to ask me, how did you do it? And I probably say with sheer luck. Potty training is one of those things that I think every parent and none of us are excited about this, about this. I mean, we're excited that they're getting out of diapers. Yes, we're excited about that. But the idea of potty training, it's such a daunting responsibility. And I think it's one of those topics that there is a wealth of information out there, right? Some, which is probably really good and some which is maybe mediocre at best. And so, it's hard to maneuver between all the information and what is and isn't the best advice given. So, I'm glad that we can talk about this and kind of pinpoint some specific areas that the parents can use as they're going through this transition because it's a big one and it should be celebrated or we no longer have to buy those expensive diapers, right?
Cassie: It's true. And you're right that it is really overwhelming. I think we as parents put a lot of pressure on ourselves to get it right the first time, and we hear stories about kids who potty trained themselves or in two or three days, they're done. And so, we feel like we have to know what we're doing and get it right the first time. But the reality is, is that it looks different for every child. But there are some basic principles, like you said, that can kind of guide us through the process so we don't get lost in trying to choose which technique or which book that we need to follow to make sure we're doing it the right way.
Jen: OK, so let's start in the beginning. Let's talk a little bit about maybe some signs to watch out for. That will make us more aware that our child is ready for this stage. So, give us kind of physical sings, maybe emotional signs. I don't know if you can necessarily pinpoint an age and you can talk about that, but some readiness factors that we want to look for. OK.
Cassie: There are a lot of things I know we've all probably seen the lists on, like the ads for pull ups that they give you, like three or four bullet points. And they make it sound like if your child is doing these things and they're ready. But the reality is, is that there is a lot that plays into it. Like you mentioned, there's different areas in which a child develops, so physical development, they have to have the muscles developed enough in order to be able to control their bladder. Right. We can't just like we can't force a child to stand up and walk because we want them to walk around. We can't force them to be able to control those muscles either. So, the way you can know that those muscles might be ready is you'll start noticing that their diapers drying for a couple hours at a time. They might wake up dry in the morning or they might not. The night control comes later, but you might notice that you might notice that they go hide to poop, or they'll tell you that they're peeing like they seem to be aware of what's going on with those muscles. So that's something to look for. And then language development is also something that we want to look for. They've got to be able to tell you or the babysitter or whoever is there, what's happening and then and that they need to go and they need to be able to understand the instructions that you're giving them, right? And then, of course, the social emotional piece I think you mentioned that to. Kids have got to want to do it, and this will probably start happening as early as like 18 months or so, they might want to follow you into the bathroom. They're going to try to peek in there, see what you're doing, what are you doing with the toilet paper? Was the flushing doing? They're interested and they want to copy. They want to be like mom and dad or big brother or sister, whoever it is in the home. Right? And they also want to be independent. So, you're going to start noticing maybe they take their diaper off. Maybe they're trying to pull their own pants up and down. And just another area is not even necessarily only related to toileting, but you'll start noticing “me do it by myself” right there, buckling their car seat. They're picking up their own food. When you start to notice that desire of I want to be big like everybody else, that's a good sign that they might be ready to start potty training, too.
Hilary: Oh, that's such a helpful list. I love it because I think so often parents go off of my child is two, which means I better start. Yeah, and they kind of, you know, set aside the rest of the list and they just focus solely on the age of the child. And so, I think it's super helpful to look at all the different factors associated with it. So, I don't know if you can put a number on it, but typically, when do you see most kids’ kind of reach those milestones age wise?
Cassie: So, what you normally see is, they'll say, between 20 and 30 months, most kids are closer to the second birthday. So, twenty-four months, a little before, little after and just know that really, it can happen any time. But the closer you get to the third birthday or after the third birthday, the three major jokes that people make are real, right? Three-year old’s, they get a little more rebellious. They are trying even harder to assert their independence, so it can be harder for you to try to tell a three-year-old what to do and tell them to go to the bathroom. So, you'll avoid a lot of the power struggles and behavior parts of it if you are able to catch it a little earlier and do it before they hit that stage.
Hilary: Mm-Hmm. I'm thinking of my own children and they were all, most of them were late potty trainers and my son, he, he had all of the readiness signs except for the cooperation compliance. He did not want anything to do with it, and he was probably close to three, maybe even maybe even three and half at this point. And so, I can see the beauty in starting just a little bit earlier before they hit that stage, because that was probably the biggest hurdle for us to overcome.
Cassie: Yeah, and you got to think about it, too. Using a diaper is a habit. So, one keep them in their diaper the longer you're just enforcing that habit of going the diaper and your fine.
Hilary: Interesting, OK, I like that. OK. So, we as a parent were noticing most, if not all, of these signs, and we're ready to jump in. Where's the first step? What are what do we go? Where do we go?
Cassie: Good question. The first thing I would say is don't tell anybody. The minute you put it on Facebook, everyone's going to tell you how to do it, or they're going to start asking you, how's it going? And you'll feel pressured. So just keep it quiet, right? As a side with yourself and your partner. I would say maybe even pick a day on the calendar. Write it down and then kind of prep for a couple of weeks before I start talking to your kid about we're almost out of diapers. Show them, you know, the box is almost gone and we're not going to buy more. You're going to start using the potty, get them excited for it. And then when that day hits, you can, I mean, if you need to take a day off work or if you pick to maybe start on a weekend, not that you're going to have it done in two days, but you do want to really focus the first couple of days because you're going to have about a five to ten second warning when they say they got to go right. So, you want to make sure your home kind of clear your calendar for a couple of days, if you can, and then just prepare yourself, know that it's going to be messy. You are going to be cleaning poop off the floor. That's just how it goes. But as long as you have prepared yourself and your partner, whoever is going to be helping you do it and then also prepare the child. So, it's not just like one morning they wake up in this comfort item, really, in the diapers. All of a sudden, Gone, you can kind of prepare for what's going to happen.
Hilary: So like we mentioned earlier, there's a lot out there and a lot of these articles and advice that are given, they tend to have a timeline. Potty training in a day, potty training in three days, which probably is helpful to some, but that's a really hurtful to others. If you know, we finish the day and it's not done so. So, you say about a week that maybe we want to designate that. I mean, you have one for most, what does it seem like? It tends to take.
Cassie: It really is just going to depend on the child and how ready they are when you begin. I did try one of the three-day methods with my daughter, and it worked wonderfully. And I'm actually just about like probably this weekend or in the next few days, I'm going to start potty training my son and we'll see. I don't know if we're going to get it done that fast. That's OK. I think it's just important to remember that this is an emotional experience for you and the child us because we have so much pressure of let's just be done and I'm sick of these messes. And why are they not getting it? What's wrong with me, right? Why am I not able to teach them this? But also emotional for them. And all of a sudden there's these new expectations and and yeah, my diaper is gone and I have this routine. And so just being prepared for all the emotions that can come along with it and being prepared to not take that out on the child, we never want to get mad at them or show them that we're upset or frustrated when they do not make it to the bathroom in time.
Hilary: Alright. So, the day has come. We've kind of warned our child, we've circled the calendar. We've showed them how many diapers are left in the in the drawer. It's day one for us. Kind of set the stage, are we setting timers. Are we leaving pants off? I've heard a lot of parents that do that. What should are our first day look like?
Cassie: So, there are a lot of different methods. I've heard a lot of success and I had success myself in the naked from the waist down just because the child can feel what's going on faster and you can see it too. Right? Yeah. If they wear underwear, you might not notice for 10 minutes. They're walking in wet, but if they peed on the floor, you can catch that real quick and maybe even get them to the bathroom before they're done. So, stay near a bathroom. It's a good idea to pick one bathroom in your house, especially if you have an upstairs and downstairs. Just stay where you're near the bathroom. You can choose to have a little potty or an insert. There's all different ways of doing it and just pick what's best for your child. A three-year-old might be able to climb up on the Big Potty in time. Two-year-old probably can't get up on the stool. Turn around pole pants down, sit down before they've had an accident, so a little potty is a good option. But yeah, you just want to make sure that you're always close to the bathroom. And then as far as whether or not to use a timer again, I've heard a lot of different things. Some parents have success with it, but just be mindful of the fact that that might cause stress for the child, right? But I have to sit here for a certain amount of time and moms forcing me to sit here or I'm in the middle of playing and having fun and I don't need to go to the bathroom. And all of a sudden, this timer beeps. And the other danger of the timer, too, is if you're sitting them down every 20 minutes to empty their bladder, they might not ever be getting the sensation of my mind, and I need to go. OK, so you're training them to sit on the bathroom, but they're not really learning those cues to tell themselves.
Hilary: Interesting okay.
Cassie: So, I would say kind of decide what you're going to do ahead of time. Maybe do read some books, research different things, listen to podcasts like this and kind of pick your method. I would write down your potty-training rules, stick them on the door and stick to them, understanding that you can be flexible if you need to. But if you have a plan going in, you're going to feel much more confident and then the child will have consistency, right? If you run to the store and dad's home or whatever, the other person will still be able to pick up and continue with that child. So, the learning process doesn't change, OK?
Hilary: So, I like this because so besides having maybe keeping their pants off for the day, our day should look fairly normal, right? We don't necessarily have to follow this strict schedule at timers, we don't necessarily have to fill them up full of fluids, which we know. We've heard that as well, too. But just keep your routine fairly relaxed. Don't plan a lot of outings or playdates or whatnot. Right? Make sure you're home. But for the most part, keep it a fairly typical day. It sounds like right.
Cassie: Yep And it can be a fun day because you are going to be paying very close attention to that child and they're going to notice that right. Mom is with me all day watching my every move and doing things with me, so it can be a fun bonding time, even though parents might be feeling a little bit stressed about what's going on.
Hilary: All right, so. The day is progressing. We're doing our very best, we're having some successes, but we're also having a few accidents, of course. How do we handle the accidents?
Cassie: Great question. First of all, decide what you're going to call them. We can call them accidents. We can call them learning opportunities however you want to frame that is just fine. And then decide how you're going to respond to the child and want to make sure, like I said, that we're not coming in with big emotions like, “Oh my gosh, you peed again” you know, not making a big deal of it, but just saying something like, “Oh, it looks like we didn't make it. I'm sure you'll make it next time”. Or, you know, thanks for trying. If they were on the way, pointing out the good of like, “Oh, you made it last time, I'm sure you can make it next time.” And then you can involve the child and clean up, have them carry the wet pants to the basket and bring you a rag to clean up the floor or whatever needs to happen so that they start to understand. You know, going on the floor is really not a pleasant thing, and that can help them learn a little quicker too.
Hilary: I, I'm just thinking this in my brain and I'm like, “This is so simple, but this is magic”. Like the idea. I'm not even, maybe reframing our wording of accidents because this is a new skill our child is learning. And so of course, mistakes are going to be made. And so, I love. Instead of getting frustrated, which is totally natural for us as humans, right to make it a learning opportunity and to motivate them for next time. Oh, this is so good. OK, I know what the potty training. A lot of people talk about charts and stars and rewards and prizes. Do we want to incorporate those things? How do we go about doing that? What do you think?
Cassie: Great question. This is a tricky question, too, because a lot of people have really strong feelings about whether or not to do it. I know I was potty trained with the sticker chart, and all these years later, I still remember what these stickers looked like. A big deal for me, right? But if you look at studies on child development, kind of what the experts say, we're usually recommending against doing these things. Just if you think about what's motivating the child, like I said before, at about 18 months, two years old. Kids want to be just like you. They're copying everything we're doing, saying everything we're saying. And so, it's natural for them to just have that desire to want to be a big boy or big girl, you know, in the potty. And we can kind of detract from that by making it be about M&M’s or stickers or dollar store trips or whatever that might be. So, if we really play into the intrinsic motivation of I want to master the skill and be big like everyone else, we don't really need to worry about other things and we can do that by simply every time they go, not with big, scary emotions and expressions by overwhelm the child at moments jumping up and down and screaming and so excited. But just wow, you did it. Thank you for going in the potty. You are such a big boy. The saying things like that that just play into their ego is often enough. However, I will say I know a lot of sticker charts and things like that are helpful, especially for those that maybe have already passed their third birthday. I do need a little bit of extra motivation and reason to do what mom saying, but for the younger ones, just try that praising and thanking them, and you might see that it's enough.
Hilary: I have seen lots of really big potty toys, and I'm really glad that that isn't necessarily something that we have to have as part of this process. So, I think that's helpful for parents to hear. Let’s talk a little bit of our bad time, because I know that that tends to be a really hard area of potty training where we've got to figure it out during the day, but at night it's just different. It's harder. So. So let's talk a little bit about maybe suggestions that you can offer for parents when it comes to that.
Cassie: So. Like I said, we have to wait for their muscles to be ready. And it's very common, especially in boys but in girls too, for that nighttime muscle control, just to develop a little bit later, you know, just a few months later. So, if you're noticing that your kid has all of the daytime readiness signs, but they wake up with a saturated diaper every morning, just don't worry about that training during the day. OK, tell him we're putting a diaper on to go to sleep because you're sleeping and you don't know that you need to go potty when you wake up. Take the diaper off, put him on the body and then it's underwear or commando or whatever you don't have all day long. So, it's OK to kind of think of them as two separate things and just understand that the muscle control, if physically just might not be possible right now. And that's OK. That doesn't mean we need to delay daytime training. And there's other techniques that you can use. Some people will do what's called the dream pee, so you put them to bed at 8:00 or whatever their bedtime is. And then when you're going to bed at 11, you kind of wake them up, half asleep, set them on the potty. Most kids will go and fall right back asleep. Sometimes I'll send it to parents and they laugh like, No, my kid will be up for three hours ago if I go and wake him up. So, if that doesn't work for you, that doesn't work for you. That's one thing you can try. Another tip is to limit liquids before bed. So, during potty training, we just give them water as usual, keep them hydrated. But maybe about two hours before bedtime, you give them a big cup of milk or water and then say, that's all for the morning. That can kind of help. And then I did just want to mention just so parents know. Bedwetting is very common, even in older kids, 20 percent of five-year old’s and 12 percent of six-year old’s in the United States still wet the bed. So, it's not realistic for us to expect 100 percent no accidents ever at two and a half because we got to treat them right. And something that I think is interesting is this is genetic. So, if both parents were bedwetters, there's a 70 percent chance that their child will also wet the bed. OK, so if you're struggling, go to your mom and dad and say, Hey, how is that for me? Did I have this problem too? Because I can just take some of the stress off you and helping us understand that we don't have to be totally night trained at the same time that we're training during the day.
Hilary: OK. That's good to know because I feel like there's a lot of parents that feel like they have that daytime training down, and the nighttime is not quite done yet, and they kind of put it as a loss because we haven't officially finished everything. And so, I like that idea of kind of putting them into separate categories. So, kind of speaking on that topic, I know that there's. I've heard of a lot of parents that have been trying to potty train process, and it's just not working for whatever reason. With a situation like that, would you suggest that you pause, take a break, come back to it or do we just keep working through it? Because I know I've heard a little bit of both that if we pause and try again, we don't necessarily want to do that. We just keep going. What do you think?
Cassie: I would say it really depends on the age of the child. If you started at their second birthday and it's just not going anywhere and you stop and research some of those signs of readiness and you go, “Yeah, I jumped the gun”. They were not ready. It's OK to stop and come back, and you can explain that to the child. “Hey, I think let's use diapers again for a little bit and then we’ll try again”. But if the child's older, if you've got a three and a half anywhere from three to four-year-old and it's not happening, first thing to do would be talk to your doctor because there could be something physical going on that they just really can't, right? And they might need a little bit of help. But if you are in that older stage, I would say that just muscle through and maybe find some other techniques and reach out for help. There's parent education programs like Parents As Teachers, you might have something near you that could help. You can also, in cases where a child maybe does have behavior issues or sensory issues, you can reach out to a therapist or an occupational therapist that specializes in helping with issues like this. And there's nothing wrong with you or your child if you need to ask for help. Just know that if you are in those older stages and you're still struggling, it might be a good idea to see what resources are available.
Hilary: OK, so speaking of that, one of our biggest struggles with my kids was not necessarily number one, but number two. And we would be great with number one. But I had a poor little one that would just hold it in until he was in pain. And do you find that common with a a lot of kids?
Cassie: Yes, that's very common. One thing to understand I know it sounds silly, but from a little child's perspective, they see that as part of their body. So, to let it go into the toilet and you have a big splash and there smells and I'm supposed to flush that away. That can actually be really scary for kids. So, if that's the problem, you can start by the emotional piece. Let's validate the emotions. You feel kind of scared to go. Maybe you feel kind of embarrassed about this, normalizing it, even if you're not a family that does a lot of potty talk. You got to talk about it, OK? And that can really be helpful. Also, for some kids, a good first step is when they're expressing that they do need to go. You can put a diaper on them, sit them on the toilet. So, they're kind of still learning. I need to go poop on the toilet, but they have that comfort of cocaine in the diaper and you can do that for the first few times and then try without.
Hilary: OK, that's great. I've heard both sides when it comes to pull ups, any. What what's your personal opinion on that? Because I've heard that it's a little bit confusing. I've heard don't do it at all. What is that? What does the field tell us about that?
Cassie: Personally, I see it as just a marketing strategy. The diaper companies want to make more money off you because a pull up is just a diaper that's flat, right? And they cost way more than diapers. If you want to try the pull up, you can just do that with the diaper. You can snap that I put together before you put it on practice, pulling it up and down because that's what a lot of people want them for is they want the child to practice up and down, but that solves. But really, it's just a diaper. So, you've got to decide, am I totally doing away with diapers? And that means no diapers or pull ups? Or are we going to explain to the child in some situations, right for nap time or for a long car rides, we do still use that. And then you might use a pull up or even use a day so
Hilary: So we can be used because I've heard a lot of people say that it's just a crutch and some kids will continue to wet in their pull because it does. It feels like a diaper, but it's an option.
Cassie: Yeah. I potty trained my daughter about a year or two ago, and when I started, I was like, No way, I'm not using pull ups. I had read all the reasons had to, but I did buy one package and we didn't call them pull ups and puppy underwear because they had Paw Patrol on it. And we taught her that it was underwear, and we did only that for, you know, we're going out somewhere. And if she peed, there would be a big problem. Yes. And we actually never had a problem with her. I think a lot of it was just how we presented the pull ups, how we explained them to her and the fact that we only use them sporadically was helpful for me. But again, that's one child and one case. So, parents going to experiment and see what works best.
Hilary: Okay. All right. I feel like there is so much I have gotten today and I need another child to potty train and use these tips.
Casse: You can come and train my son.
Hilary: Haha So, as we kind of wrap up any final words of advice to these parents that are ready to start this?
Cassie: Like I said, just make sure to keep your own emotions in check. It can be stressful and you can get to the end of day one day to day eight and be like, Oh my gosh, what is wrong with me, right? I cannot figure this out, but just know that it's different for every child. You've done it a few times, and you know that it's different. Oh yes, child and parents will discover that as they go along. So, take your time, do whatever research you want to do first. But just remember, it's not that big of a deal. It seems scary just because it's the first thing we've had to actually teach them, right? They learn to crawl and walk and all those things on their own. And this one's on us. So, it does feel a little bit scary, but just go on public, walk around, notice how many adults are wearing diapers. Right? Everybody gets it
Hilary: They will figure it out!
Cassie: Yes, it'll work out. And don't be afraid to reach out for help if you need here at the family place, we do offer a free virtual potty-training class every quarter. Our next one is on July 13th. Perfect. So, people can join by Zoom if they want to class. But there are a lot of resources out there, so don't be afraid to ask for help and do some research and then just trust yourself and trust your child that they want to do this and they'll figure this out, OK?
Hilary: So, for those parents out there that are thinking Yes, yes, 100 times, yes, I need that virtual class, where do they go to get that link?
Cassie: You can just go to theFamilyPlaceutah.org and under the Events tab, that class will show up. OK. Like I said, the next one's in July, but we do it a few times a year. So, if you miss it, just stay tuned.
Hilary: OK, perfect. Guys, you are already out there. You can do it. No, we want to thank Cassie for being here. We love having her on our podcast, and she shares such wonderful tips. And so hopefully you have been able to listen, maybe even take some notes and feel a little bit more confident as you transition into this exciting new stage for yourself and for your child. Thank you for being here, guys, and we will see you all next time.
Jen: Thank you for listening to the Parents' Place podcast, if you would like to reach us, you can at parents, theFamilyPlaceutah.org or you can reach Jen on Facebook. Jen Daly dash the Family Place. Please check out our show notes for any additional information. Our website is the family place you taught if you're interested in any of our upcoming virtual classes. We'd love to see you there.
Subject Resources: Cassie works as a Parents-as-Teachers educator. Home visiting program that provides you with a one-on-one parenting help. Potty-training, feeding issues, sleep guidance. They know it all. Find a local Parent-as-Teachers program near you : - https://parentsasteachers.org/program-locator-1 - The Family Place Utah Potty-Training Virtual Event, July 13th, 2022: https://thefamilyplaceutah.org/event/potty-training-class-3/ Contact:
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